Episode 8 - Kelly MacLeod Sobriety Coach & Women to Women Network Chief Membership Officer

In this heartfelt and real conversation, I’m joined by my longtime friend and Sobriety Coach, Kelly MacLeod. From shared careers and community leadership to raising daughters in the same school system, our lives have intertwined in so many meaningful ways. 

This episode dives into a topic that deserves more open dialogue: sobriety. Kelly recently celebrated nine years sober and shares her powerful journey, which didn’t start with a dramatic rock bottom or a formal program, but with a quiet, life-changing decision to choose better for herself and her daughter.

We talk about:

• Why not hitting rock bottom doesn’t make your story any less valid
• The importance of community, and how shame often keeps people from seeking support
• How to respond with grace and respect when someone shares they’re sober
• The shifting culture around alcohol, especially among Gen Z
• And how open, honest conversations help break the stigma

Kelly’s vulnerability reminds us that it’s never too late to change your life. Whether sober, sober-curious, or supporting someone on that journey, this episode is a space for truth, encouragement, and compassion.

If this message resonates with you or someone you know, please listen, share, and continue the conversation. You can also reach out to Kelly at kellymacleod333@gmail.com. 

Thank you for listening! Connect and collaborate with Realtor Rashelle on any of her social media platform pages > https://linktr.ee/RealtorRashelle

Transcript

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Welcome to the Realtor Who Wins podcast. I'm Rachelle New meyer, your hostess with the most as a student of life, a connector, a passionate wine enthusiast, and your local favorite guide. Join me as we explore the vibrant Pacific Northwest. Savor the finest wines and champion the spirit of entrepreneurship. Each episode I'll sit down with inspiring guests, supporting business ownership and uncovering the stories that make this community unique. So grab a glass of wine, settle in, and let's embark on a journey of discovery and connection together. Cheers! Thank you so much for tuning in to episode eight of The Realtor Who Wines. I'm Rachelle and today I have Kelly McLeod with me. I'm so happy you're here. Cheers, Kelly. Thanks. Thank you for joining me. Thank you for having me. So Kelly and I have been friends for a long time, and we are paths. It was like we were destined to be friends, actually, because our paths just kept crossing and crossing and crossing. And finally we were like, I think we're friends or I think we're friends now. So we're both in real estate. We both are in leadership within a very large networking organization. We both live in the same area. We both have daughters in the same school system. And like just all the things we both love sports. We definitely love a good basketball game. So we just connect on so many levels. And so I wanted to have you on because we can talk about so many great topics that not everybody always talks about. And one topic I definitely want to dive into today is sobriety. Because even though I'm the realtor who wines, I think drinking responsible is really important. And then also as a woman in business and in the business field, talking about alcohol within working and like the business sector too. So thank you so much for joining me today. Really appreciate. It. Well, thanks for having me. Yes. Exciting. This is one of my favorite things to talk about. Get which we have. I love that because some people think sobriety is like a dirty word or they like or shy about it or. And that's some of the stuff I wanted to talk to you about today and also how people should react when they, like, are having a conversation with someone that's sober. I feel like they treat it almost like, ooh, you know, and you're like, what? Yeah. Why? Yeah. What are you doing? Yeah. Enjoy your beverage. Yeah. I'm not impacting you, but. Yeah. Before we dive into that stuff, do you mind sharing a little bit of your journey and your story and, and then. Yeah, we'll go from there. Yeah. Well, this will be boring for you because some of it you've already heard. But it's okay. I love, I do love talking about it. So I just celebrated nine years sober at the end. Whoop, whoop. February. And, you know, some people envision, a person's decision to get sober based on some sort of rock bottom, you know? Sure. Like I woke up in a ditch somewhere. Yeah. It was get sober or die. Yeah, yeah, and that's not always the case. It's not for a lot. It can be. But, I woke up one morning and I was just really tired of being tired. I was tired of being disappointed in myself. I was tired of not feeling well. I was tired of just feeling the shame and just knowing that I could be more. And that I wanted more for myself. My daughter was nine at the time, and I was also very aware that before I knew it, we were going to be having conversations with her about drugs and alcohol, and I was feeling like a fraud. So am I going to have these conversations with my daughter when I'm struggling as much as I am? Yeah. And so it just I just can I swear, I just get tired of my my own bullshit. Yeah. You know, and, so there was a rock bottom for me, but it wasn't like what everybody. Thinks is more like your own mental state. Yeah. You know, just really, really tired of it. So, tired of myself. So I just kind of white knuckled through the, the whole process. And so you made that decision. You're like, you know, enough's enough. This obviously isn't a good relationship for me as far as my relationship with alcohol. I'm going to go cold turkey. I did I went cold turkey, which I would say to anybody out there, you know, make sure that you talked to a doctor and you, you know, you do things the right way so that it's safe for you. Everybody knows their. Own. Well, just like any journey, everybody has their own. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I did not go through a program. I didn't go to rehab. I didn't go to AA. Reflecting back on my the start of my journey, I wish that I would have, you know, because community is such an important thing. Sure. As you were. Yeah. You and I both know. Yeah. And I feel like there is a lot that I probably could have learned early on through that community, but. And just to have that different support system when you are having harder times, like the hard days. Yeah. But there was so much shame around alcohol. I was 40 years old and like, this is embarrassing. I'm a 40 year old woman, like, I need to get it together. So I didn't feel, I just was embarrassed. Yeah. You know what's now looking back to you now? You know, you shouldn't have that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And now that's part of why I choose to talk about it. Because I don't want somebody not to get the help they need. Absolutely. To make a different decision because they feel that shame. I don't care how old you are, you can always improve yourself. You can always. 100%. Decision and you can do that tomorrow you know. Yeah. So I think that's why I'm such a big advocate just well I mean you and I talk about everything like. Yeah, if you're talking honestly and with good intentions and in good faith, I think you can talk about anything. And that's how I feel about this. Too, when I think things that are talked about more than their. That eliminates the shame. Yeah. You know, and so that's why I really thought it was important to have this conversation with you and share it with my listeners, but then also just share it with anybody that might be listening that knows that they need to get sober and hasn't taken that step, or knows somebody that needs to. And so I just think we should talk about it. And I do think, I don't know if you've noticed this, and maybe if I'm only noticing it because it's more mindful for me now. But I do feel like mocktails are absolutely huge right now. And, also talking about sobriety, the Gen Zers are not really interested. And the toxic relationship with alcohol, which has been interesting as I interview a lot of winemakers and stuff, they're talking about how it's changed a little bit just because messaging around alcohol has changed, or how the younger generations are looking at alcohol like they are. If they consume, it's at a limited amount. Yeah. Which is healthy, right? We don't want to encourage different. Yeah. But I do think now it feels, at least to me, becoming more and more common to have the conversation. So I do think that's good. One thing. So how you kind of brought it up, for me, like I made my mental awareness around it was we were she wasn't even talking to me. I was just listening. I was like, what was that? No, but we were in a networking group and we were talking about and it's with a group full of women from different industries calling at both just happened to be in real estate. And but she had mentioned it's really tough being in an industry where all the socialization trainings, connections are around alcohol, like happy hours. Mama says all those things and it made me sit back and reflect. She wasn't speaking to me directly or at the time, I was, president elect for Women's Council of Realtors in Oregon and or in Portland. And I was like, oh, and I started going through our events calendar, and I was like, oh yeah, that does have alcohol. That was alcohol. That was alcohol. I wonder how many other agents are coming to this stuff. Yeah, because there's alcohol. And it's not because you can't say no or it's a temptation, but for you, it's just like an annoyance, like, well, I don't want to stand around while everyone's getting drunk and they're not going to remember my name. Yep. Ten days later. Yeah. You know, and so I thought, So we actually, because of that comment you made at a totally different networking group, that wasn't to me, I went back to Women's Council. I was like, hey, let's change our calendar a little bit and let's make some of these morning things that are what, like coffee only type stuff. But talk about that a little bit and your frustrations or how you've noticed that a lot, especially in the real estate industry. But I was a corporate kid and it was the same way with corporate too, like so it's everywhere. But it really is everywhere. And it's just it's interesting to me because I try to be really careful and, and we've talked about this like, I don't want to put my relationship with alcohol on to anybody else. Right. So maybe for everybody else, being at a CEO class at 11 a.m. with mimosas is just how they're going to get through it. I just don't love it. Like, I just think it's odd, like there aren't a lot of jobs that would be

encouraging you at 11: 9:01

00 on a Tuesday. Sure, have a drink and then get out there and go do your work. Go drive around and do showings. Like it just it's such an odd thing for me, but I'm always very careful. Like, again, my relationship with alcohol is mine and I don't want it, but it sure is. Just not. I just don't like to be around it. I just don't think it's necessary. I question whether or not we are, We are our best selves in those moments. Then if you're having a couple of drinks while you're trying to learn something, that's meant to help you be better for your clients. I mean, not that people are necessarily just getting hammered, but also. Like, yeah, they're it's not like keg stands going out or anything. Yeah, I don't know. To me it just feels unnecessary. And so that was part of it is just I just don't think it's necessary in that environment. But it is hard to be the only kid in the room that's that's not drinking and trying to have those conversations. Thankfully, it is much more common now, and I think people receive it differently than than they used to. Right? Yeah, it was kind of like though I argue, and I think people are better now at just taking it at face value. Yeah. Well, no, it's not like you're saying to like alcohol should never be included at any work event. But it is very true, especially in our industry, that like, they are trying to attract people to come to learn about a certain topic, right, by being like, and there's wine or like and there's order or whatever. Yeah. So instead of just people coming to talk about the topic or learn about the topic and I agree with you. There has been times where I wasn't partaking in any beverages because of what I had going on afterwards, and then by the end of it, you're like, do you even know my name? We've been talking for 20 minutes and I am pretty sure you can't tell me my name right? Yeah, I had those moments where, and again, I'm not I do not worry about myself. Sure. Yeah. And I and I want people to have fun, you know, do do their thing. But, I definitely have left events going. I'm never going to hear from that person again. Yeah, yeah. Well, and everybody's journey is different too. So, like, you're in a different place with your journey where you can go to a networking thing that's in a winery and you're not having withdrawals or wondering, like wanting to do anything, but there's other people that are just starting their journeys or something like that. So that's all I, I do think it's something that all businesses should think about when they're hosting a work related thing, like, can you have beverages? Sure. But should it be at every single training? Should it be the focus of the training to get people at the training, like maybe pick really great content, or you don't have to use alcohol to draw people to come to it. And I do wonder how many people were the same class, just so many of them. Yeah, the same thing offered, but without the mimosas. Is someone truly showing up only because there's mimosas? I, I don't know. Yeah. I think it's a half and half. But I. Really do. Yeah. Like, well, maybe we, I think it's a topic. Well, especially now in-person classes. I think that's how they're trying to get people back to be like in person. Yeah. So they're like, the class isn't enough. We need free lunch or we need this or that or whatever. Yeah. But yeah, I just don't think it's necessary all the time. Yeah. And and then when you said that too, like, it creates this weird conversation when people are like, oh, did you need a drink? Yeah. And then you're like, oh no, I'm good. I don't drink. And they're like, oh, oh, you know, like, oh, what's her story? I wonder what she's up to. And I could be like a ton of stuff. We have a another really good friend of ours that's allergic to alcohol. Like she has like a huge breakout, but she has to explain that every time she goes anywhere, instead of just being like, no, I'm good, thank you. People. But people want to know why. Yeah, but it's weird. If you order seven drinks, no one is like, why? Right? Right. You said there was a comedian that talked about, you know, if you don't get mayonnaise on a sandwich, nobody's like, bugging you about you have mayonnaise on your sandwich. Like, why is alcohol the thing that everybody is like? It's a trigger for some reason. Yeah, especially a certain age groups. I'm glad to see that the younger generation as a as focused on that. Yeah. Me too. I've started to say, no, I don't drink on purpose. Yeah, that usually stops people or they'll look at me and go, what's that mean? And then I'll tell them like, oh, it just celebrated whatever it is. Yeah, oh that's great. And then we move on like just so that it doesn't, we don't need to drag it out. And sure like. Yeah that that I just I don't drink. Thank you. Yeah. What were some of your fears like when you were thinking about like you knew I need to get sober. I need to make this choice. What were some of your fears that were keeping you besides the shame? Yeah. Where? There other things that you're worried about that was keeping you from making that decision? So it's really interesting. When you are drinking, you have an off switch.

So it's 5: 14:11

00. You have a drink. You feel I'm saying you. I felt, like that was my permission to sort of end my day right? I think a lot of people do, if they have a drink. While they wind down. Yep. Exactly. And so, it again, it was just it was an off switch. And so I think I was really afraid that, I wouldn't have that off switch. I wouldn't be allowed to wind down. I would have to be productive all the time. And I still struggle with that a little bit because, I mean, especially with what we do, there's just stuff going on all the time. So it's really hard to balance. Not being productive. You're in business for yourself. Yeah. Because you feel like you can always be doing more. And so alcohol was a very good way to, like, shut my brain off. Yeah. And just take a step back. Yeah. And it just again, it was that permission at the end of the day to just not working anymore. I'm not, you know, so I think it was afraid it was going to have to like always be doing, doing, doing, which I do kind of feel. But I know alcohol would not make that better. Right. I think, well, I was definitely scared that I wouldn't be able to do it. Right. Like I was afraid that I was going to be one of those people that would fail my whole life. Yeah. And that would have been I think that's why I didn't talk about it for the first few years, because I was afraid that if I did and I relapsed, that. You had shame either way. Oh my God. Yeah, I was going to feel like an idiot no matter what I did. Right? And it's still something anybody that has ever had any kind of addiction knows getting complacent and being so sure that you're never going to relapse is a very dangerous place to be. So, but I'm much more confident, like I don't even after my going through everything I did with my brother, being in the hospital and passing and all that. Not once was I thinking, gosh, I would sure like a drink. In fact, it was quite the opposite. Yeah, so thankful because I was fully present for the whole thing. And, and. And you could show up for the rest of your family. Absolutely. Yeah. And it it's just, you know, alcohol, taking alcohol out of your life doesn't suddenly turn everything to rainbows. Right. Like it. It doesn't it. Certainly it stops making your life harder or worse. But it doesn't. You have to be the one to make it better. You have to take steps every day to make better decisions. And the first has to be, the way alcohol or whatever your choice is or, you know. Yeah. So I think early on, I was just really afraid that I wouldn't, I wouldn't be successful. I wouldn't be able. To do it. Yeah. For sure. I mean, anybody that's trying to change make any kind of lifestyle change, that's always a major fear. Like, can I actually do this? What happens if I put it out into the universe and I don't do it, or I don't do it? Well, and then, yeah, I had, you know, well, you know, I have someone in my life that also got sober, and the last few years. And one of her biggest concerns was, are my friends going to still want to hang out with me? Because so many of the things that we would do is like, go to a winery or when we'd have Girls Night, it'd be like board game night and drinks and dinner or whatever. And I wasn't always like focused around alcohol, but obviously alcohol was part of it. Right. And pleasantly, she's been pleasantly surprised, actually, how like, no one cared. Good. Like everyone's like, okay, great. Yeah. And then or just pivoting activities like you and I've talked about this before too, like as someone that obviously I'm the realtor Hawaiian. So I go to wineries, I try my wineries all the time. I'm very active and social person. When you and I were first becoming friends, there were certain events I was having. That was at a winery that wasn't winery like specific, but it was at a winery, and I didn't know yet where you were in your journey. I just knew that you were sober. Yeah. And I was like, do I invite her so she knows I want her there? Or is it insensitive if I invite her? So talk a little bit about how someone like in my position back then finally I just asked you. Yes, obviously. I just said probably the best thing. Yeah, yeah. I was just like, I really want you at this, but I don't want to be a dick either. Oh, sorry about that. But like, you know, like, I don't want to ask you to come to this and then have you be like, why would you invite me to this? You're so insensitive when really I was like, I just want you to know, I want you there, and I appreciate you. Yeah. So what should someone that's trying to support somebody in their sobriety, like, what are some ways that they can support them or include them? I think it's just exactly what you did, which is like, hey, I really want you. There it is at a winery. How does that feel for you? Were you good with it? You know, I usually give the example of, like, if we're going to a winery in the activity is wine tasting like that is the purpose that we're there? Yeah. Then I'm probably going to sit it out. Sure. Because, like, I don't want to drink soda water and watch you guys talk about. How the wine taste. Yeah. Or whatever. Yeah. It's like, smell it. You're like nothing. Yeah. It's it. But if it was like painting at a winery. Absolutely. Then you can come because it's like there's another activity. Yeah. Like we're, we're they're doing something else. It just happens to be at a winery. But yeah, I think for people that have loved ones or friends that are sober, I think it's really just asking the question, like, we really want you around, but we also want you to feel comfortable. So no, it's totally okay. Is there something else that we could do? One of the worst parts about being sober is like being the friend that people feel like they have to, like, make special arrangements for. Like, sure, you're. Not going to be comfortable where we can go someplace else. You're like, okay, it's going to be fine. Yeah. And people are trying to be thoughtful, but then you're like, am I the reason they're not going to have fun or, you know, yeah. People ask, is it okay if I drink? And you know, which again, being super, super sensitive and very thoughtful, but it also does suck because you kind of feel like you're in my, like, buzzkill. Right? You know, like, yeah, you can't have fun because I'm here. Like, that's a terrible feeling. Yeah. But that I. Think like why I prefer you didn't because you drove. Right? Right. Exactly. You drove me here. Yeah. Arrive alive, you guys. That being said. I, I think because I got sober later in life. I also like, I didn't really have a bunch of friends that were just like big partiers anyway. Right. You know what I mean? It's totally different when you're like especially when we were in college. Yes. It was a lot different than yes. What I'm hearing is like today in college. But yeah, if I had been in my late 20s, early 30s, it might have been I might have had a different feeling for sure. Everybody that I know is all kind of in a similar situation. So yeah, there wasn't a whole lot of like, we're just out being crazy, right? It's just going nuts. Yeah. So, and maybe that's part of why I waited for so long, because it finally felt like I wasn't going to be missing out on a ton of stuff. Well, in your daughter, like you already mentioned, she was a huge part of your decision. Yeah, that the timing of that was was huge. I just I just I just kept coming back to that. Like how many how am I going to be able to help her make good decisions or save when I'm not even doing it for myself? Right. It just I just couldn't yeah. I just couldn't see past that. If someone, I do want to talk about a couple other things, but if someone is thinking about getting sober and doesn't know where to start, what's a piece of advice that you would give them? I would definitely reach out to somebody. To me, anybody. I think being willing to have the conversation and just say to somebody else, say the words to somebody else, hey, I'm really struggling here. I think that that's really important. The first few times you say it's really scary and then suddenly it it's like, okay. Yeah, that, that, that went well, you know, and just start having conversations. Depending on the, you know, the type of recovery that you might be interested in. Certainly look for a community, whether that's AA, whether they're different online options. And there really is a lot more online options. I didn't realize I think a lot of people, again, were so like manipulated and skewed by movies and all that stuff where we just think like it's one thing, but it's not like a dirty church basement. Yeah, that's like, you know, like there's like all these meeting places all over, including online, where you can just hop on a zoom and have that kind of community. Yeah. And like listen in. Yeah. And there are so many books now. Some are very like science based, super heavy into the, the why of, you. Know, the chemistry. Yeah. Exactly. And then some are, are much more mindset related. And I'm very much a believer that it is a disease. I don't think this is a willpower issue. So if someone out there is feeling like, why can't I just tackle it? It's it's not that easy, right? You know. Yeah. Well I think there's different correct me if I'm wrong, obviously, but what I've noticed now, having different friends like yourself that have gone through different sobriety journeys or had different relationships with alcohol to cars that is, different types of alcoholism, because, again, my naive ness at the time was just picturing somebody like I've seen in the movies that like, is hiding alcohol all over the house, like can't function without a drink. But now I've known so many people are like, oh no, I could go weeks without drinking. It's just when I drank, I couldn't stop. After two or whatever. Or there's just like different relationships with it to, you know, whatever. But I just think of somebody that is trying to support somebody in their sobriety, just being really mindful. Like all the journeys are different. Yeah, there's totally different levels of alcoholism in relationships with alcohol. And I think if somebody tells you that they are struggling, the best thing to do is just ask, how can I help? Yeah, it is, it is not. I've had some friends that are like, I had no idea you drank or you had a problem. And I think what they were trying to be was supportive. Like for me, like, you always seem so together. And you're like, that was the booze, babe, right? Here's the thing. And that's kind of what it is. It's like, if someone I see this all the time, like there is no quiz that you can take. Like if you think you have a problem with alcohol, you have it. Right? Yeah. Like, you know. Doesn't matter if you drink every day or once every six. Just like if you can't put the ice cream bar down, you have a problem with ice cream, right? It's like what? You know what your problems are. Exactly. And I think that's the biggest, the biggest way you can support somebody is if they say they're struggling with whatever it is, whether to call or brownies. In my case, but it's just to accept that and that that's true. That is something that's difficult for them and ask how you can support them. Yeah. And, I mean, that's why I genuinely say, like, I will talk to anybody and everybody about, alcohol. Somebody, a dear friend of mine from college was sober for five years and posted about it on social media, and I had lost touch with her, but it was because she was talking about it that I finally felt comfortable to reach out to her. And that's where it all started for me. Yeah. And so the decision that I made once I made the decision, was I wanted to be that person first. Yeah, I love that. Even just. A phase. Like, they don't ever have to talk to me, but know that it can be done right. Absolutely. Well. And that's why when I was talking to you. Because, again, we talk a lot about everything. And I was like, I want to start this podcast. I'd love to have you on. And you're like, what? You're the realtor that whines that I go, yeah, but I think it's important to have these kind of conversations, like, you and I have this conversation all the time. Let's open that door for other people to have that conversation. Yeah. And just how to interact as a professional at industry events. If someone says they're sober, don't act like they have leprosy. Like be kind is, you know, like it's no big deal. Move on or don't ask 22 questions about it. Yeah. So like, oh, cool. So where are you working at these days or whatever? Like talk to them about how you would talk to them if they were holding a beer or like I don't know why that has to be the focus. Yeah it does. It can get very awkward. Which is which is now why I've said like, yeah, we usually we, we can move on from there. But, yeah, there is a little bit of like, I promise I'm still fun. Like I'm a joy to be around, I think. Yeah. Yeah, I, I would agree, I would agree, I know that we don't have a ton of time left, but I do want to talk a little bit just because we both network a lot. And about women collaborating over competition and our industry. And so, you and I talk about this too, is like to completely pivot networking and like how it's an art and like how some people don't. I didn't realize until we were in the leadership positions that were and that like, because I'm a natural, like social butterfly, so I can just walk up and ask 22 questions. But how? Some people don't know how to network or how to, like, put themselves out there, have those conversations. So what kind of advice would you give someone that's trying to, like, get out and about and make some connections? Yeah, I think it's getting really clear on your intention for networking and whether it's for each event, you kind of hang yourself up like, what do I want to get out of this event? What do I need from this event? And whether it's, you know, I want to meet somebody that is in the social media marketing space or I want to connect with a new winery or what? Yeah. Clear on your intention. Why are you going? So that that can kind of be your Northstar as you're having these different have focus. Yeah. You do need to focus. In general. And I think this is where you and I connect a lot. I don't necessarily network, for the transaction. I never know how they do business so that when I am giving a referral or I'm asking for a referral. Yeah, I, I know the person well enough to know they are going to get the job done. Yeah. And so mine is entirely based on the, on the relationships and getting somebody, getting to know somebody well enough to feel good about giving that referral. And that does take time. Yeah. And so it's finding the right space. Like if you don't have time truly to get to know people and build those relationships, that might be a different kind of networking that you need to do. You might need to do more of the BNI style where there's, you know. It's very transactional. No offense to be honest, but it's just our structure. Yeah. But yeah, just looking for again, it's you getting clear on your intention. Like what do you really need from networking and making sure that you're doing that in the right group in the right space? Yeah. Because I think people can get really confused everywhere. Absolutely. I think too, like, as in real estate, we're connectors. And so we get asked all the time, like, do you have a roofer? Do you have a plumber? Do you have a mechanic? Do you have a good dentist especially? I help a lot of relocation families and so they don't know anybody. And so I'm helping them find a hairdresser like all the things. And so that's why I network. I'm never out there to be like, give me business. Give me business. I'm more there to be like, I need you for my client. I need you for a client, I need you for a client. And I think that just totally changes to. Yeah. To your point, it's funny, we had, greeters here this morning, and I wasn't here, but I talked to an agent when I came in, and I was like, how was it? And he was like, yeah, it's the same old stuff. I just went around and introduced ourselves. I go, well, you got to network with intention, bro. You got to walk in and be like, hey, yeah, I'm so-and-so. How can I help your business grow this year? Or how, you know, like, let's collaborate, let's partner. Tell me more about you. And I was like, you're such a coach. I know I can't help but you. Feel like after the number of years that we've been doing this, I mean, we've been networking together for, what, probably four years now? Yeah. That really is the single best piece of advice I could give somebody clear on your intention for that event. Yeah. Within that group. And I think you'll see a different kind of success. Yeah. You really can dig into, like, what do you need out of this and then start asking for it. Yeah. And just for anybody brand new out there, if this. I can only speak for myself. I know you feel exactly the same way. If you walk up to me and you hand me a business card before you tell me your name or shake my hand, I'm never calling you, okay? Keep your. Course. Likely not, because that is so transactional. And that's just not who I am or how I operate. And it's crazy to me how often that happens. Or people walk up and be like, oh, I know, you know, a lot of people, can you introduce me to ten people? And I'm like, hi, I'm Rachelle. Yes. And you are like, I can't just introduce you to ten people who are you? Yeah, like, so start off with more connections and building like, don't just like dollar sign, dollar sign, dollar sign. You know. Yeah. Nobody wants to work with that person, by the way. I want it to be I want there to be that reciprocal like benefit thing where we're kind of in this together. Yeah. Right. When I, when I get a, when I get a great referral for you, I will happily give it to you and hope that we know each other well enough that you would trust me with your referral. Absolutely. Whatever. Yeah. Whatever the case may be. So, yeah, I'm I'm not good at that. I oftentimes in our group, I forget to tell people that I'm a real estate agent. Yeah, I just I enjoy it. You're building a relationship. Yeah. I just love seeing. Yeah. The women that we're working with. Growing their business and have to be reminded like, oh, yeah, I'm here for. Right? Yeah. Oh. Shoot. Why was. I here? Yeah, that's what I thought. I was here for this tax. Right. Well, and with that being said, too, another way that we connect with the networking is we are both big believers in networking within your own industry and outside of it. Yeah. Again, the collaboration over competition. Yeah. We could have easily met the very first time in. But like she's at a different brokerage, she's going to compete in this group for the same business. But neither one of us ever thought that. And I have just found like collaborating and within real estate. And it's very empowering. It's nice to partner with other agents or to bounce ideas off of other agents to understand what goes into real estate, the behind the scenes, and then turn around and ask people outside of your industry, hey, what do you think about this? Would this be appealing to you? But to your point of what you just said is like, I can't handle every transaction, you can't handle every transaction. You're going to be well versed at something. We've given referrals to each other and we live like ten minutes from each other. So we cover the same area. Yeah, but we have we've partnered up together and then we've also bounced like, you know what that would be. You would be great with Kelly. Yeah. And or vice versa or whatever. And so I just think that's really special. And a lot of people go into networking with blinders like, oh, you're my field. You can't look at you, can't talk to you, you know, or if you see somebody talking, I've seen people do this, especially in real estate, where they see one realtor talking to somebody else, and then they won't ever go talk to that person because they're like, oh, that agent already talked. To, right. Hello. That's not about yeah, that's not how it works. Plus, you might need that person for something else. So like again. The number of agents that we know I can't I can't serve everybody and I don't want oh my gosh, I don't want to go out to Northeast Portland. Most like. Yeah that's not your. Area dear friends that work out there would love to refer them because they're going to be better able to serve that client for you to try to get out to. Northeast Portland is going to take far too long. I can't be spontaneous with that one. You don't know the area as well. So as soon as they're like, where's that good coffee shop? You're going to be like, Dear Google, where's a good coffee shop? But yeah, like I think being able to admit that, like the integrity that it takes for people to admit I know I'm not the best fit, I truly believe that will come back or yeah, that karma will come back around and serve you in that. Like I want what's best for you. And I'm not that. Yeah, yeah. I'm okay. Admitting that. Absolutely. Said we wouldn't have the relationships that we have to say. But I know somebody that's amazing out in that area. Let me give you that number. Right. If you were never networking within your own industry, yeah. You were closed off to that. You wouldn't have confidence. Yeah. I have three I have four families under contract right now. Three of them were referred to me by other realtors from building relationship. One is, a realtor I did a transaction with in Coos Bay. Talk about not knowing my area. For those of you listening, I don't normally cover Coos Bay. It's 4.5 hours from where I live, but it's kind of a story. I do cover Lincoln City, which is only an hour from where we live, also on the coast, and they were like, my clients are just like on a whim, can we just go look at this one in Coos Bay? And I was like, oh, okay. I didn't want to say no because I was like, well, what if we go to Coos Bay one time and then they end up buying in Lincoln City? I'm just, you know, I'll take a Saturday. It's fine. Rylan went with me. Yeah. We made a whole weekend out of it. But the point is the realtor. So they ended up buying in Coos Bay. And so the realtor on the other side of that transaction, she's like, girl, what are you doing out here? And I was like, it's a story. It's yeah, but I didn't want to say no because again, I was putting my client first and I told them I was like, I don't normally cover this area. And they're like, we get it. And they appreciated that. I went, yeah, but I befriended that agent and now her and I refer people back and forth all the time. So two of the transactions I'm in right now, we're clients. She referred to me. And so it's just building those relationships and working together. And then she is same way. She's like, I'm not driving 4.5 hours. It's the abundance. Yes. It's just the abundance mindset that there's going to be enough. Your your client will find you that, you mentioned Ryland. And I think part of the other reason that I got sober, obviously, I've talked about my daughter, but I think the reason that we probably network the way we do and probably just part of who we are is to be examples for our daughter. Absolutely. It's yeah, if I am not a good example for my daughter, I'm not a good example. Yeah. I always want her to see because like the time period that we grow up was, women were pointed at each other. Even in corporate America. You also had an office job before you got into real estate. And it was just like if you were the token female in the group that made it to the boardroom, you probably slept with somebody, even if you didn't. Right? But that was what was going on. I've been accused of that multiple times, and I was like, the numbers speak for themselves, folks, you know? But it's hard. And so like, women were pitted at each other. And so I'm already trying to show Rylan that's not the way. Yeah, we all make it to the boardroom when we work together. Yeah. Like instead of like, oh no, I, you know, kind of a thing. So I love you and I do both have that mindset of like, what are the girls seeing? How are we behaving? I mean, I've spent my time multiple times because Brandon was standing next to me. Yeah. You know, I was just like, rise to the occasion. Don't say it. Yes. Don't say. It. Yes. No, I yeah, I just I want her to see that that. Yeah things can be done a different way. Totally like compete where you need to compete. Yeah. Also don't worry. Yeah I need to, you know. Yeah. So yeah obviously you and I could talk all day. In fact, actually we do talk every day. And we still always have so much to say. I appreciate you being on. I hope that you'll come back for another episode. But thank you. Thank you, I appreciate it. I'm so excited. I will tag Kelly's information and the podcast and on YouTube. So depending on where you are watching or listening, if you have questions, she really is open to you. Reaching out to especially about sobriety stuff. Yeah, but not real estate. Yeah, only I sell real estate. Reach out to her for everything. Thank you. Cheers. Cheers. Thanks for watching and listening. We'll see you next week.